It's time to rethink the mechanical injection legalization again.
Again I am tired of fuel delivery issues costing me money again.
Having issues burning a piston in the same cylinder on 2 different motors due to either a power commander, injector( top or bottom), ECU, wire harness, or throttle bodies. I purchased a power commander 5 and auto tune to try to remedy these types of problems and here i sit again with burned pistons.

Now I know with mechanical injection this it is possible to burn pistons, but I can narrow it down faster and probably cheaper.
If the cost is the answer for not having mechanical injection, then lets throw in the tires and adjustments, and all the other money making rules out there that cost more total than a good motor.
Every one wants to pick on the motor guys to keep costs down but in reality the injection guys and car manufactures and tires cost way more than a good motor.
Bring on Mechanical injection and let us decide if it is right or wrong for us.

Moose

nothing's simpler than the twist of a barrel valve, change the pill or spring, or both, and twist it back together... it can be done in 10 seconds... i agree with ya moose...

ya i think they should just make the rules for the motor and injection run what you brung just put a cc rule on the motor thats the way it is going anyways. theres nothing stock about are so called stock motors with all the other stuff out there and what the engine builders are finding out to make more power.

nothing's simpler than the twist of a barrel valve, change the pill or spring, or both, and twist it back together... it can be done in 10 seconds... i agree with ya moose... Exactly Hawk EFI was made for pollution & gas mileage MFI was made for racing. I know what your saying about not being stock anymore but you still need a good set of rules to keep things under control. :)

it would be nice to have something that you can actually work on! unless you have a electrical degree your crap out of luck with the EFI, been there done that and tired of it. the time is here for a change! i think the entire 600 class needs to take a good long hard look at a spec tire rule also, any one who has ran a ASCS2 tire knows that thing is bullet proof and just keeps working.
just my thoughts.

Not for anything guys , but you have another alternative besides MFI . It's Carbs . We have been working on an all American made system and expect to have it Racing in about 10 days . It will cost alot less than any of the other systems and we expect to outpreform the other systems . Simpler also . Along with your thoughts about fuel systems you should consider some of the aftermarket ECU's as well . There are plenty of them in the same price range of what you currently use . If an Idiot like me can program them imagine what you could do . They are very user friendly . You don't need Autotune or power Commander either . I don't have any clout or voting privlages so you guys should keep this dialogue going and get this resolved . I will be posting photos of our new Oval Track version " Down-Draft " Carb . setup very soon . Do not just focus on MFI because alot of great stuff is out there . It all should be considered . No matter what system you use in the future you still should have it dynoed so no one will be excluded from this process . That shouldn't be an issue . It's not a question of $$$$ anymore it's more about politics .

i think the entire 600 class needs to take a good long hard look at a spec tire rule also, any one who has ran a ASCS2 tire knows that thing is bullet proof and just keeps working.
just my thoughts.

I here you there, I put that poll out over the winter and more people favored it than not, but it didn't go no where, and so far this year everywhere I've been you could use it come feature time,

Kenny

can i be the first to say I told you so lol.... i agree 100% hopefully it becomes legal over the winter without any stupid throttle body rules

I really think with the group of racers you guys have in the 600 class that if the spec tire was pushed hard enough (beyond this message board) it could be accomplished.

I here you there, I put that poll out over the winter and more people favored it than not, but it didn't go no where, and so far this year everywhere I've been you could use it come feature time,

Kenny




I really think with the group of racers you guys have in the 600 class that if the spec tire was pushed hard enough (beyond this message board) it could be accomplished.


Believe it or not, most of the racers I talked to are not in favor of a spec tire rule. Not sure why, I am in favor of one. Mike Dicely even talked with Hoosier and American Racer and they were on board to give the U6SA its own spec tire with a stamp. But, it still didn't pass.

Now we are getting off topic. This thread was started to discuss getting MFI into the U6SA...

i believe the biggest prob with this whole spec tire, mfi, and all other rules that tracks, racers and who ever else vote on is that racers are all for them selves. spec tire deal a couple years ago was pushed hard and it was.. we'll bridgeport doesnt burn up tires so there not in favor for it, or this track burns up tires so there in favor for it. this is the case with all rules for the u6sa, down to the 800 weight rule proposed last year.. when asked a group of racers what they thought there awnser was.. well i already add weight so i vote it down, and others were we'll i dont so ill vote yes. Or when asked about Rods in a motor, Racers were we'll how much are rods, o well there that much so no i vote that down. OR mfi last year.. we'll how much does that cost, same stuff accrued, does this benifit me right now or no, and ill will vote accordingly. so i dont know what the solution is, but in general it sucks,

^^^^^ agreed

We need to step back from our personal agendas and ask... "Will this change benefit the 600 class, not just in the here and now, but in the future?" It is very hard for someone to step back from what they personally believe and try to look at the bigger picture.

take all the in car adjs. out and give you my vote to your injection

zach can you explain how this voting works. i was under the impression that we the drivers and car owners can be overruled by the board. not sure how it works
please explain

RACERS we ran the EFI for 6 years never burned a piston over 30 races a yr. its CALLED preventive maintence not using worn out parts STOP CRYING we now run STOCK I mean STOCK air box, air filter,injectors,fuel rails ,on ALKY at 38 lbs. NO power commander,& we are still rich ALL FOR UNDER $300.00

Frist off if your not running the hardest compound tire out there then your burning the tire off yourself. Further more if this tire is so great that your talking about why don't you just run it why does there have to be a RULE. :)

double D.. are 270s looking at a possible spec tire for next year, i must of missed where there was a thread for 270 tire rules.. Last i check this was about 600s

zach can you explain how this voting works. i was under the impression that we the drivers and car owners can be overruled by the board. not sure how it works
please explain

Jeff, sent you a PM.

double D.. are 270s looking at a possible spec tire for next year, i must of missed where there was a thread for 270 tire rules.. Last i check this was about 600s

What may be about 600's, eventually affects us in 270's a few years down the road... so for the time being, don't be so closed minded and judgemental to a non-600 person...

if it filters down ,then why arn't you guys forced to buy bladder tanks, you carry the same amount of fuel , i had a bladder before it was maditory , like they said in grade school learn not to burn !

What may be about 600's, eventually affects us in 270's a few years down the road... so for the time being, don't be so closed minded and judgemental to a non-600 person... Exactly!!!! :)

I couldnt agree more with rat, Lets see how great all these "shoes" would be with adjustments everywhere. I would be willing to bet that 75 percent of these guys racing now get in a car and do nothing but just click away on those nobs. Set the chassis up and drive with how you set it. I watch guys moves nobs before the race even starts?? Hey if they did it 30 years ago without adjustments here and there i think we can all do the same.

As for the Manual Fuel injection, Our team looked into buying that rather than running the EFI, it all comes down to who wont be able to make the money anymore. If you take away everything that these builders have set up now and a lot of the teams switch over, the big names are going to start loosing their money they invested and now have to go into something yet again "new." Plus MFI would just make life to simple, and we all know thats just to damn easy.

Spec Tires...Why not? Thats right because to many people would complain just like they are already. Set the car up to work with those tires they tell you, you have to run. It's funny just last night at the usac show, all the big teams had spec tires and there cars worked just fine. The 600's and 270 cant even be put in the same category to me and im pretty sure theres plenty of people who agree. I Have both, the 600 has a strict set of rules and things you have to follow where as in the 270 no one that "I" see is giving 2 sh**s to even see what some of these guys are running and are doing. Theres guys running whatever they can come up, and hey I'm all for new things but within limitations, and to me theres no one writing those limitations.

Just my Two Cents
Mark Manieri
Manieri Motorsports Fab.

wow, i just got back from KTown racing/owning a 600 how about you double D.? or Hawk? my point is with double D is that he has no clue on what 600 racing is, 12years at borgers does not give you the incite nor the knowledge of what it takes to run a top 600 team, or how many tires 600 teams burn off, or what expense goes into the motors, or what great racing is ETC... it seams that some people have there own opinion on 600s but never been to a race or better yet owned, drove, or worked on one. and show me where 600 racing has filtered down to the 270s.. actually 270s seem to be a steping stone for the 600s.. more people go from 270s to 600s then the other way around... when double D has owned, raced, worked on, watched ETC i will value his opinon but untill then, some people should just keep there uneducated, have no clue opinions to them selves.

wow, i just got back from KTown racing/owning a 600 how about you double D.? or Hawk? my point is with double D is that he has no clue on what 600 racing is, 12years at borgers does not give you the incite nor the knowledge of what it takes to run a top 600 team, or how many tires 600 teams burn off, or what expense goes into the motors, or what great racing is ETC... it seams that some people have there own opinion on 600s but never been to a race or better yet owned, drove, or worked on one. and show me where 600 racing has filtered down to the 270s.. actually 270s seem to be a steping stone for the 600s.. more people go from 270s to 600s then the other way around... when double D has owned, raced, worked on, watched ETC i will value his opinon but untill then, some people should just keep there uneducated, have no clue opinions to them selves. The only thing JAY I have not done is owned a 600 all the rest I've down For your Info one BIG thing that has affected the 270's from the 600's is all the good 270 tracks that got ruined size wise for the 600. Further more if I'm so wrong then you have nothing to be concerned about but that doesn't seem to be the case. :eek:

you just have a comment about everything on here. if someone was talking about space and stars you would come on here and give your opinion on how you have expierence on driving a damn space shuttle. my point im tryin to make is you have no idea what it is to race or own a 600 yet you make comments on everything that deals with 600s.. experience of goin o Nazareth years ago, or flemington, or been around racing is fine.. but commenting on what and how much owner/drivers in 600s spend, or what injection or tire to use in the 600s or any other aspect of 600 racing is dumb b/c you have no backing or experience with 600s maybe you would be able to use your experience for safty reason or something like that but commenting on cost/maintenance/racing one sorry its just annoying.....just b/c you might watch 2 600 races a year doest make you an expert. MOOSE started this tread b/c he has been running injection for years and knows what injection is and what probs can come about with injection. so he has a legitimate opinion on injecton so there for his opinion is educated and thought out.. whens the last time dave you had a wiring issue with your injection, or burnt off 2 tires in a nite only running a heat and feature...

I agree with the MFI 100% it doesn't really affect me anymore but ive been there, 2 years ago we burnt 5 pistons in 6 weeks. After every time we burnt a piston a new pump filters and injectors went in the car (always seemed to be number 2 cylinder) but when you talk to the EFI guys we weren't doing weekly maintenance, and we were the only ones having this problem. Now that I have the MFI on the midget i don't understand how anyone thought EFI was better, ever. It is so simple and also safer then the EFI that is being run. With MFI when the motor is shut off the fuel supply is also shut off, with EFI the fuel pump continues to run pumping 60+ PSI. With the MFI you clean it every week it takes about an hour and you wont have a problem there are no moving injectors to stick and the pumps are virtually indestructible. Thats it there is nothing else there no you don't need 8 injectors a power commander 5 or GUTS tune. And on a side note i guess running a 270 at Borgers magically makes you a geneius about every single thing in racing, damn i guess we screwed up lmao.

I might be mistaken but doesn't guhl make a u6sa legal mfi??? Just has to use stock throttle bodies... Just a thought

you just have a comment about everything on here. if someone was talking about space and stars you would come on here and give your opinion on how you have expierence on driving a damn space shuttle. my point im tryin to make is you have no idea what it is to race or own a 600 yet you make comments on everything that deals with 600s.. experience of goin o Nazareth years ago, or flemington, or been around racing is fine.. but commenting on what and how much owner/drivers in 600s spend, or what injection or tire to use in the 600s or any other aspect of 600 racing is dumb b/c you have no backing or experience with 600s maybe you would be able to use your experience for safty reason or something like that but commenting on cost/maintenance/racing one sorry its just annoying.....just b/c you might watch 2 600 races a year doest make you an expert. MOOSE started this tread b/c he has been running injection for years and knows what injection is and what probs can come about with injection. so he has a legitimate opinion on injecton so there for his opinion is educated and thought out.. whens the last time dave you had a wiring issue with your injection, or burnt off 2 tires in a nite only running a heat and feature... Well Jay from hearing you talk we must spend alot of time together heck maybe I should be charging you room & board. When in all reality the last time we talked was what 2/3 yrs. ago. So don't come on hear & pretend like you KNOW ME!!!! Thanks kmac for backing up the things I was pointing out about MFI. :)